Winston, I got lost here: ============================================ Do not orthodox jews (I hope I have that right) and muslims deny the existence of the Devil in their religion? ============================================ Do Orthodox Jews and Muslims recognize Jesus Christ as 'the way, the truth and the life'? Cheri

Hi Cheri, --------------------------------------------- Do Orthodox Jews and Muslims recognize Jesus Christ as 'the way, the truth and the life'? --------------------------------------------- I don't think so. From my understanding though, they both recognize Jesus Christ as a religious figure but neither recognize the devil (I was just making a comment on Daves message). I could definitely stand corrected on this though.

Winston, I see. Cheri

Hi Folks, Before the Holy War or the Jihad erupts I'd just like to re-visit this: ==================== "To quote one of the most misquoted passages from the Bible, "The LOVE of money is the root of all evil." 1Ti 6:10 This can be expanded to apply to all material things that could be bought with money (money, itself, is simply a tool)." ==================== I hear these words a lot from all sorts of people. Whenever I do, I start by asking them whether they really believe that money is evil. The answer is usually that too much money is evil. So how much is too much I will ask. That's an interesting question for most people because rarely can they answer it. They just stick with "too much." At this point I say something like: "Can money commit murder? Or arson? Or theft? Or sexual assault?" "Huh?" "Can a dollar or a peso or a ringit or a pound drive a knife through a person's heart, or light a fire to burn down a building, or steal something or commit a sex crime?" "No." "By itself can it perform a life-saving operation, or save a child from drowning or give mouth-to-mouth resuscitation?" "Of course not!" "OK. So you would then agree that money is neither negative or positive?" "I guess so." "If that is the case, you might also agree that it is the person who uses the money that uses it for good or evil purposes." "Yes." Then I ask: "Do you think that you are basically a good person or an evil person?" Naturally, everybody says: "GOOD!" To which I say: "Then you had better get as much money yourself to deprive the evil people of it because they will surely use it for evil purposes." Hmmm... I think that far too many people (mis)quote this saying just to make excuses for themselves. Look at it this way... if you accumulate enough money for all your needs then you can give the rest of it away to others who may need it more than you. I think I remember reading about an American industrialist who did just that. Was it Carnegie? Living off the fruits of love is wonderful but try explaining to the electricity department or the supermarket owner or the bank or the gas station attendant why you have little or no money to pay them. The sad reality is that we are needing money in ever-increasing quantities to pay our way through life. The "average" home mortgage over here where I live (Western Australia) has just crept over $300,000 AUD (about $225,000 US). The median price of a (3x1) home here is $310,000 AUD (about $232,500 US) and you don't get an awful lot for that. How does that compare where you live? (Cheri?) I just thought I'd explore this "evil money" concept a bit further. I know it's a bit off-thread but this discussion seems to be meandering all over the place anyway. What do you think? Gary

Gary, Couldn't agree with you more. But I grew up in what we call the 'Bible Belt' here in the US, our southern states including Texas. That misquote was what I was taught, and it took my entire lifetime up until the past year or two to get over to some extent the negative image associated with being aquisitive of anything, even the basic necessities. I can still be thrown into guilt mode if I post something that someone responds to with commentary along the lines of "Everybody just thinks about money. Money isn't everything. I'm perfectly happy without money." And someone invariably does. I posted a series of three installments of an article someone else wrote in my Money 101 forum and caused quite a backlash among some of my readers. I was roundly scolded for it by some of them. Sometimes we need to just get away from everyone else's reaction and think it through for ourselves. Then we can get back on the right track. Weird, I came here to answer your quesion, and look what came out. I must be taking things too much to heart. To answer your question, the US has vast regional differences in home values. I live in Utah, and more particularly the Wasatch Front which includes Salt Lake City and about an hour's drive to the north or south. Our market is red hot, just coming out of a period where our prices were flat--unlike rest of the country where property was appreciating rapidly. Now we're playing catch-up. Our average home price is around $225,000, for a 3 bedroom, 2 1/2 bath home of 2100-2500 square feet (usually including a basement in that measurement). That's up from $167,500 only two years ago, and still climbing rapidly. There are parts of the Midwest and South where a home the same size would run between $60,000 and $100,000. In California or New York, you might have to pay close to $1 million for the same one. Don't ask me how people manage to live in those places. Maybe that's why our country is ravaged by debt. Sorry for the super-long post. I could go on for another two or three pages, but I won't. Cheri