Hi: Peter said; ========================================= A lot of the so called help that people offer is based upon wrong information that they themselves think is correct and it might not be.. ========================================= This is very, very true - and nowhere is it more rampant than in the "how to make money" field. A prime example is the vast number of people with a background in direct marketing that are promoting "how to make money" programs online. There was a thread on Michel Fortin's forum a while ago in which he observed that response rates to a sales letter were only high when the traffic came from a trusted referral. Response rates from search engine traffic and "unreferred traffic" were substantially lower. I was impressed that he posted that in public. Most people with DM backgrounds will "swear by" their methods and refuse to accept that there might be better ways to sell on the web. One of my clients cleared 100K in December alone. There is NO sales letter on the site. Not one. Another client cleared 16k. And again, no sales letter to be found. The same thing applies to many aspects of the web. Search engines. Websites. Traffic. Lots of people that offering to help others when their own information is limited in scope or even outdated, but they don't know it. Add to that the number of people with mail order phds and fake testimonials from their cronies, and it's a very confusing place for anyone that wants to learn, but doesn't know who to listen to. A solid commitment to continued personal growth is the only true path to success. Sometimes personal growth means knocking your heros off their pedestals when they turn out to be full of hot air and sometimes it means finding new mentors. Hence - it's very necessary to have the fortitude to keep on keeping on. To question everyone and everything. To base decisions on results, to see failures as steps towards success... and to never, ever give up. : ) Linda P.S. What a great thread!

Linda, ============================================ Sometimes personal growth means knocking your heros off their pedestals when they turn out to be full of hot air and sometimes it means finding new mentors. ============================================ I think it was our friend Winston Scoville who observed in another of your threads that it's difficult to know whom to listen to when there's so much hype out there. I missed Michel Fortin's forum, but I'm glad to have validated through your reference to it that I'm not missing much by cancelling almost all the "How to Make Money on the Internet" newsletter subscriptions that I've subscribed to over the past year. I decided to do that when I noticed that 4 or 5 of them always seemed to come out with the same sales letter and headline at the same time, promoting the 'next new thing'. It's a pity that there are so many people taking advantage of the indisputable fact that people are desperately in need of inexpensive solutions. Having found a little hype and a little expertise and a whole lot of wonderful people here at Adland, I have to again express my gratitude to Bogdan for providing this resource and for persuading you to come back so you can be my new mentor. :-) It has been learning from your very well-reasoned posts that has helped me sort out experience from well-meaning ignorance. The hype is fairly easy to see, but the well-meaning ignorance can kill your budget a nickel and a dime at a time! Cheri

Linda, I love your forum. Did watching "What the Bleep Do We Know?" drive you to create this thread? I must see this movie. Your grouping makes sense to me if I assume that people that seek your help do it for business and not "Just Shooting the Poop". You asked... Do you think the "nature" of people in Group #3 is learned? To some extent I would agree. I always believe you are, what you were, when. The ability to learn and the nuturing we get has a tremendous impact on our success. Higher education has a way of re-producing higher education. But while it's true that anyone can change, there are some limiting factors. The context of this forum is business and the ability to grow a business, generate profit and reinvest to continue the cycle. But how accurate would it be to assume that the majority of AdLanders visit this forum for business purpose? I remember joining AdLandPro to get some free advertising credits for my website. Now, I'm having to make some serious decision as to what is the real purpose to belonging in this community? My purpose has changed. Something else that comes to mind is what I call the "Security Blanket" factor. If you have reached a level of financial abundance that allows you to venture into something new or expand an interest, it's possible that your determination and hence success will not be as high because you have already mitigated some risk. Jack PS Don't forget to post your stock pick for 2006. It's for fun, free and no wrong answers. Plus you get to see some real companies. It's an open invitation to everyone in the world.

Hi Cheri; ======================================== I'm glad to have validated through your reference to it that I'm not missing much by cancelling almost all the "How to Make Money on the Internet" newsletter subscriptions that I've subscribed to over the past year. ======================================== That alone is probably the smartest thing you did, and I mean that very seriously. I'm not being glib, flip or sarcastic. There was a conference for writers some time ago in which the "speakers" were best selling authors. After the speaches, the audience got to ask questions. One fellow asked a best selling author "How can I learn to write better?" The author said "Read better books." That's SO true. Everything we read affects our mind. If we read hype everyday, we begin thinking that way, and then talking that way. Our minds are affected by the people we talk to and the "input" we subject it to. We can choose what to feed our brain, or we can let society and advertisers feed it mental junk food. That's part of the choices we have at our fingertips. : ) Linda P.S. Thanks for that last paragraph, too. Of course (as you know) I prefer not to have a pedestal, but to sit cross legged on the floor with the rest of the people I try grow with. And grow I do. I grow as much as my students (clients) do. The more I teach, the more I learn. Glad to have you among us - you definitely add to the group here. :)

I enjoyed your three kinds of people. In answer to your question I feel that the nature of people in #3 is learned. As we grow through our lifetime we learn from our own experiences. I have been told by many people that I am a life long learner. I look at life as challenges that we are given to grow as a person. Our character also is created as we complete these challenges. We take courses and research to be able to jump these hurtles. This is what I feel makes life fun and exciting. I am new to AdlandPro, my plan is to gather information that will help me in developing my new site, and at the same time I hope to help others. I started my website almost a year ago. This has been a challenge that has met many road blocks. I know with the information I am gathering and perseverance, I will be able to jump this hurtle and be among the success stories. Thank you to everyone that is contributing to AdlandPro.