Hi Geketa,

Yes, I agree that B Hussein has an agenda and knows any aid will find it's way to the Hamas and not be used for humanitarian reason. Hence the change in laws that will allow aid even if Hamas will be part of the PA government. 800 million $s buys lots of weapons.

You mention PC as part of the problem and I agree but we have to add greed and possibly fear to the equation.

The European politicians have been bought off (just as banks and financial institutions worldwide including the US have been with Shariah banking money). Stealth Jihad!.

Fear is another point to consider. This issue can be expounded on in long dissertations but suffice to say that not many could or would be willing to live as Geert Wilders is with death sentences hanging over his head by many Muslim terrorist groups. And add to that the fear from litigation (another form of Stealth Jihad) and here you can again use Wilders as an example. He proves that it can be done and that ethical and worthy men are out there willing to take up the fight.

I agree that living under Islam would be worse then death and I thank you for sharing your thoughts with us.

Shalom,

Peter

 

Hello Robert,

Of course there are many issues that have to be dealt with and some of them extremely important.

We know that a word taken out of context can in some cases be the downfall of a public figure even if later the truth comes out. To late and the damage is already done. The Pope is a bit above that and is not so easily destroyed.

There are religious dilemas all over the world and in the US as you well know. It's not only a problem in Europe but world wide. The issue once again  is turning into what is politically correct and what is not. The bottom line is that we all have to decide that being PC is not necessarily the correct way and choose our paths accordingly.

While you claim that the probllem is a Christian one I have to disagree with you when it comes to Islam. Islam is against all religions and believe that all infidels are the enemy that have to be either converted or killed. Of course the Jewish religion is number one on their "hit" list but all the others are right behind them. Therefor the fight is a common one to all that aren't Muslims.

Every contribution to this fight is important and can't be discounted. I wouldn't worry much about what the little politicians and others are trying to do to Christianity if Islam takes over and dominates the world as is their plan. That problem would be a moot issue and as I said to late.

Fighting extreme/Radical Islam in my humble opinion is the major concern of the world today and it compounds when they succeed in electing one of their own to a powerful position as they recently have.

Shalom,

Peter

P.S. Google isn't Republican unfortunately. They are great supporters of B. Hussein Obama.

 Hello Friends,

I read an interesting article about Islam and their attempt to tackle one of the major problems (one of many) they have with the West's accepting Islam and their dubious claim that Islam is a religion of "love". [Yep, lots of love there).

The present issue they are trying to "tackle" is "death for Apostasy". As many of you know that is one point that has been discussed and in the different Islamic countries many have been put to death for the "grievous sin" of converting to another religion. In the past week a couple in Egypt was murdered for the simple reason that the wife a former Muslim secretly married an Egyptian Copt and went into hiding when they found that they were to be arrested and executed. They were found and then murdered. Again for the simple reason that the woman converted to another religion and married out of Islam. BTW, a Muslim man is allowed to marry a non Islamic woman cos the woman is considered to be inconsequential!

An interesting point discussed amongst these Islamic scholars was not should the sinners be killed as the Koran commands ( sura 4:89 of the Koran, which urges Muslims to seize and kill those who turn away. The Hadith, or traditional writings and sayings of Mohammed, include one in which he commands, “Any [Muslim] person who has changed his religion, kill him.” [The big Mo was quite a guy]) but when. Some give a period of "reflection" for the sinners to repent ranging from 3 days to 3 months I believe. Lots of mercy and "love" there. But if they don't repent Kill Them!.

So they decided to start a six man task force to study the "issue" and present their recommendations. Hmmmm, wonder what that will be? possibly a 6 month reflection and repentance period??? Now, that would be very loving and merciful.

Read the full article below.

Shalom,

Peter 

Islamic Scholars Wrestle With Death-For-Apostasy Issue
Thursday, April 30, 2009
By Patrick Goodenough, International Editor

(CNSNews.com) – An international Islamic body has appointed a committee of six religious scholars to study one of the most contentious issues in Islam today – whether “apostates” should face the death penalty.
 
The decision was taken Wednesday at a conference in the United Arab Emirates hosted by the International Islamic Fiqh Academy, an organ of the Organization of the Islamic Conference (OIC) that is responsible for interpreting shari’a, or Islamic law.
 
Attended by 200 scholars from dozens of countries, the five-day conference, which ends Thursday, has grappled with issues ranging from the environment and financial questions to ways of controlling the issuing of fatwas (edicts) on sensitive matters.
 
Under some interpretations of shari’a, Muslim men who abandon Islam or convert to another faith, and who refuse to return to Islam – usually within a specified, limited period – can be put to death for apostasy.
 
Saudi Arabia, Sudan, Iran, Afghanistan and Mauritania are some of the countries where people have been accused or convicted of apostasy.
 
Mauritania’s criminal code, for instance, provides for a three-day period of reflection and repentance for any Muslim guilty of apostasy, “whether by word or action.” “If he does not repent within this time limit, he is to be condemned to death as an apostate and his property will be confiscated by the Treasury.”
 
Scholars have debated the issue down the centuries, according to religious historians.
 
At a simple level, those who argue for the death penalty invoke writings such as sura 4:89 of the Koran, which urges Muslims to seize and kill those who turn away. The Hadith, or traditional writings and sayings of Mohammed, include one in which he commands, “Any [Muslim] person who has changed his religion, kill him.”
 
Others counter that in order to deserve death the apostate should not only have converted but also be a danger to the community or society, equating it with the crime of treason. They often cite the Koranic injuction, in sura 2:256, that “there is no compulsion in religion.”
 
Participants at the International Islamic Fiqh Academy (IIFA) conference debated the issue on Wednesday, with some scholars calling for a review of the death penalty requirement while others insisted that it be retained, the Saudi Arab News reported.
 
“Religious freedom is a right that should be guaranteed to every human being,” it quoted an Egyptian government minister, Mahmoud Zaqzouq, as saying.
 
A prominent Saudi religious law professor, Muhammad al-Nujaimi, argued that scholars in the past did not differ substantively over punishing apostates. They only differed over how quickly the apostate should be executed – after three days, a week, or several months, he said.
 
Al-Nujaimi reportedly shrugged off criticisms from human rights organizations.
 
“These groups will never stop attacking Islam even if we were to agree to all their demands,” he said. “We will never allow others to dictate our religion to us.”
 
IIFA secretary-general Abdul Salam sl-Ebadi said a number of OIC government representatives wanted the apostasy issue clarified. Six scholars had been tasked to study the issue and submit recommendations, he said.
 
Earlier, OIC secretary-general Ekmeleddin Ihsanoglu told the conference that a proliferation of individual interpretations on religious issues was encouraging extremism, and damaging the Muslim world.
 
Among other things, he pointed to the inclination of some Muslims to denounce others as apostates, saying this could lead to sectarian conflict such as the Sunni-Shia strife in Iraq.
 
‘A lifetime of fear’
 
Together with controversies such as the ill-treatment of women and clerical justification of violence, apostasy frequently features in criticisms of Islam.

Last year Iran’s parliament voted in favor of a bill that will provide for the death penalty for any male Iranian who leaves the Islamic faith while women converts would face imprisonment.

 
The draft law is now being considered by Iran’s Guardian Council, a legal-religious body appointed by Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei and empowered to approve or veto legislation.
 
In Saudi Arabia, apostasy is on a par with rape, murder and drug trafficking as offenses punishable by death. President Bush last November used the opportunity of a Saudi-initiated interreligious meeting at the U.N. to urge the kingdom to scrap its prohibition on religious conversions.
 
In Afghanistan, Christian convert Abdul Rahman was sentenced to death in 2006 for apostasy, but after the U.S. and other Western members of the coalition forces there brought pressure to bear on the Karzai administration, he was freed and allowed to seek asylum abroad.
 
The Barnabas Fund, an international charity working among Christians in Islamic societies, says that Muslims who change religions often face “a lifetime of fear.” Even in countries where conversions are not punishable by law, apostates often face hostility from their families, communities or Islamist radicals.
 
The Barnabas Fund says some accused of apostasy or the closely-associated offense of blasphemy are not converts, but rather Muslims who have questioned some interpretations of Islam
 
Sudan in 1985 executed a religious scholar named Mahmoud Mohamed Taha after he publishing a leaflet calling for Islamic law to be reformed to make it more humane.
 
Iranian history professor Hashem Aghajari was sentenced in 2002 to hang after saying in a speech that Muslims should not follow clerics “blindly.” After students protested he was retried, sentenced instead to five years’ imprisonment and later freed on bail.

CNS NEWS.Com
 

Hello Friends,

Our friend Geert Wilders is consistent and adamant to fight for freedom of speech and basic rights for all. As we already know he isn't intimidated by threats nor is he shy about expressing his opinion.

Recently he spoke at the Freedom of Speech Summit in Florida and CAIR (funded and backed by the Muslim Brotherhood) attacked Florida's House of Representatives Majority Leader Rep. Hasner for participating in the Summit.

Geert Wilders held a joint press conference with Lord Malcolm Pearson in response to CAIR's attacks.

Shalom,

Peter

Wilders: Why I Am In America Fighting for Free Speech

Freedom of expression is under attack. That is the theme I am addressing here in America this week as part of the Free Speech Summit being held in Florida under the sponsorship of the Florida Security Council. And it is clear that a serious discussion of the threats to our freedoms in the West cannot come too soon.

For example, my friend Rep. Adam Hasner, the majority leader of the Florida House of Representatives was attacked in a press release issued by the national office of the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR) on Monday for daring to appear at a private event with me this past weekend. Because of that appearance, CAIR is demanding that Rep. Hasner step down or be removed from his position.

This attack on a friend and fellow legislator is of grave concern to me. CAIR’s assault on Rep. Hasner strikes at the very heart of our most basic freedoms. In fact, it is but the latest episode in that organization’s long-running and determined effort to silence its critics. Indeed, CAIR seeks to suppress all those who dare to challenge the theo-political-legal program that authoritative Islam calls “Shariah.” In so doing, they are seeking to impose what amount to Shariah blasphemy codes.

It is especially important to note that Adam Hasner is not only being attacked for comments he made that are deemed offensive by those who seek to impose Shariah in America. His career is now being threatened for comments made by others in his presence – in this case, by me. Thus the Islamists are infringing not only on this country’s constitutionally protected freedom of expression but also freedom of association.

If a high-ranking public official – elected by the people and appointed to his leadership position by his peers – cannot speak honestly and openly about his concerns, and do so in places and the company of his choosing, without fear of suppression or other retribution, who among us is safe?

I know these threats firsthand. Even before the international release last year of my short documentary film, Fitna, I have faced constant death threats and protests. My name has appeared on assassination lists. I have been subject of an Al-Qaeda death fatwa. I will be charged with blasphemy and contempt of Muslims by Jordanian prosecutors. I face prosecutions in my own country and elsewhere. I was recently banned from the United Kingdom because the Home Secretary believed my mere presence in the country constituted a national security threat.

In this trying time let us recall that in the darkest hours of World War II, when the world faced a global threat from German Nazism, Italian Fascism and Japanese Imperialism, British Prime Minister Winston Churchill challenged his people to rise to the occasion and fight. He told them, “Never, never, in nothing great or small, large or petty, never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense. Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy.”

This is why I am in America this week talking about the fight we now must wage in the West to defend our liberties. Freedom of association is one of the basic liberties guaranteed not only by the US Constitution but by the European Convention of Human Rights. And yet CAIR wants to silence and punish Rep. Hasner for associating with me. If America needs a poster child for the threat to our freedoms from Islamic extremism, no better example than CAIR could be found.

This episode underscores that the threat to freedom posed by creeping Shariah imposed by CAIR’s type of stealthy jihad is not just a problem in the Middle East, or Europe. It is also a problem in America.

I will not be bullied by Islamic thugs who want to use our freedoms to destroy those very same freedoms. And I will not stand by as they seek to do it to others.

Founded and directed by members of the international network of the Muslim Brotherhood, CAIR has an explicit agenda to subvert our freedoms and impose Islamic Shariah law on non-Muslims. This is not speculation on my part. This is the testimony of one of CAIR’s founders and chairman emeritus, Omar Ahmed, who told a California audience in 1998 that this was their agenda. “Islam isn't in America to be equal to any other faith, but to become dominant,” he said. “The Koran, the Muslim book of scripture, should be the highest authority in America, and Islam the only accepted religion on Earth.” When CAIR officials say that this is their ultimate objective, we should believe them.

In just the past few weeks, the Council on American Islamic Relations has sought to silence another courageous lawmaker, Rep. Peter King, the ranking member on the Homeland Security Committee in the US House of Representatives. His “offense”? Rep. King correctly observed that CAIR and other Muslims were not providing enough assistance to the law enforcement authorities in combating terrorism-related activities in American mosques.

CAIR has attempted to silence other critics, as well. They have sued bloggers; they have defamed journalists who have asked too many questions about their terrorist ties; and they have tried to intimidate publications that have published articles challenging their putative “civil rights mission.” If they get away with it, CAIR will seek to threaten the careers of more politicians with the courage to say things and associate with those of challenge Shariah and the effort to impose it in this country.

It is utterly hypocritical that, on the one hand, CAIR claims to be defending freedom of religion in attacking Rep. Hasner when, on the other, they actively seek support from Islamic regimes that are among the worst of the worst human rights abusers on the planet – and notorious for suppressing religious freedoms.

I have been told that in an Arabic News article that CAIR officials have solicited and received financial support from Saudi Prince Al-Walid Bin Talal, whose country outlaws any religious expression except its own Wahhabi strain of Islam. You can’t even own a Bible or wear a cross in the country run by their patrons, and yet CAIR wants to lecture us about religious freedom?

The land for CAIR’s Capitol Hill office in Washington D.C. was purchased with a $250,000 donation from the Saudi-backed Islamic Development Bank and the deed to their headquarters is held by the foundation of United Arab Emirates Defense Minister Gen. Sheik Mohammed Bin Rashid Al-Maktoum. Sheik al-Maktoum’s country prohibits any non-Islamic religious proselytizing and threatens anyone caught with distribution of non-Muslim religious literature with imprisonment.

In September 2006, CAIR hosted an exclusive dinner with former Iranian President Mohammed Khatami. Under Khatami’s regime religious minorities were severely persecuted, non-Muslims were regularly harassed, and hundreds of student protestors murdered. The fact that CAIR chose to honor this dictator who is still a senior member of the Islamic theocracy in Iran tells us much.

Whether it is in America or back home in my own country, we are under attack by groups like CAIR who aim to silence their critics. This is why I am here in America. I aim to continue to fight regardless of the threats and intimidation and I am asking Americans to join with us. And when they attack good men like Rep. Adam Hasner, we must realize that they are attacking each and every one of us and the freedoms that we hold dear.

Geert Wilders is a member of the Dutch Parliament and Chairman of the People’s Freedom Party.

Jihad Watch

Hello Peter and Friends,
I am in rather a hurry today but wanted to make a quick comment here. I wonder too what the out come will be for the Islamic scholars? If they follow Koran at the end of the day the out come will most probably be death whether it be 6 months or 6 days. I wish people would just go get a copy of the book and set down and give it a good read and see if they still believe it is a religion of love.

I also wanted to bring this by it is about Geert and what happened in Florida while he was there.

Shalom Shabat ,

Geketa

CAIR Commends Fla. Jewish Group for Condemning Hate Speech

WASHINGTON, April 30 /PRNewswire-USNewswire/ -- The Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR) today commended the Florida office of the Anti-Defamation League (ADL) for condemning the anti-Islam hate of a speaker who was recently given a standing ovation at a synagogue in that state.

Earlier this week, CAIR called on members of the Jewish community to condemn "Nazi-like" statements by Dutch extremist politician Geert Wilders made recently at a Palm Beach, Fla., synagogue. In the speech, Wilders claimed that "Islam is not a religion" and "the right to religious freedom should not apply to this totalitarian ideology called Islam," all to the applause of the audience.

In a statement, ADL Florida Regional Director Andrew Rosenkranz said:

"The ADL strongly condemns Geert Wilders' message of hate against Islam as inflammatory, divisive and antithetical to American democratic ideals. This rhetoric is dangerous and incendiary, and wrongly focuses on Islam as a religion, as opposed to the very real threat of extremist, radical Islamists." Congrats Andy-boy you are officially a tool.  Were you there to hear Geert Wilders' Speech? Did you hear the context?  When he talks about the Quaran, Mr Wilders' has read it...have you?  I guarantee you that if you ever looked at the Quaran you would find it one of the most Antisemitic documents ever.

And if you heard Geert's speech you might have been touched by this paragaraph because it was written for people just like you:

Ladies and Gentlemen, still Islam is not our No. 1 problem, our No. 1 problem is called 'Cultural Relativism', the Elites that rule our countries have converted us to this sick philosophy a long time ago. Government leaders, Judges, even Churches, Trade Unions, Universities, the Media, all of them are blinded by political correctness and have chosen the side of Islam. They feel sorry for Muslims and pity them. 'Cultural Relativism' is weakening the West day by day. As a result of this 'Cultural Relativism' a little bit of the Free West dies everyday.

 It is a bit strange that the Florida ADL rushes to associate itself with the Terrorist organization CAIR,  but two years ago when a Florida condo was about to evict a tenant for putting a Mezzuzah on her doorpost, the Florida ADL did not want to get involved.

Nothing tells you more about ADL Under Abe Foxman than that. Their hearts may be in the right places but their brains and their priorities are way off.