Hi Cheri ========== Of course, you were using this situation as a springboard for the larger discussion. Why do people post that you can make a fortune overnight in their ads and then turn around in forums and plead poverty when asked to help, join, contribute, etc.? I've often wondered myself. I'd like to see an answer to THAT question, especially from any of the people who do it. ========== Yes, that was my idea. Of course, the raw truth is that the people who are doing it aren't likely to answer the question. Ricardo's answer is probably true. They are not making any money, but *hoping* if they keep blasting out the ads, they'll *make* the claims of income come true. What a delusion to live under. A shame... : ) Linda

Hi Cheri; ===== My understanding from Art's post that you referenced, and subsequent posts, is that due to his health situation he has NO money to invest in a business, and in fact has had his electricity turned off. To complicate matters further, Art's health apparently prevents him from taking a job in accounting (his profession by training). ===== Kind of a discussion within a discussion and hope you (or Art) don't mind. You mentioned that his profession, by training, is in accounting. I'm going to hazard a guess that in years of accounting, he probably has a LOT of information that business startups don't know. That happens in every trade. Someone who's "done it" for years - in ANY trade - knows boatloads that average people don't. So why don't they bring their knowledge online? Fact is, most don't. There's a guy named Mike -- has been a *dirt farmer* all his life. Calls himself Mike the dirt farmer. So, when he got online, what do you think he sold? He wrote ebooks about stuff like how to build a potting shed and gardening tips. And you know what? He's doing realy well. But that's not what MOST people do. Nope. They gotta sell "internet marketing" stuff, or "biz opps" or other crap and trash that they don't know anything about, don't know how to make a living with -- and then wail about why it's not working. And, I'm not talking about Art. I'm talking about the mass majority. But, it applies to Art, too. Do you think he might be qualified to write an ebook called "Accounting Tips for Business Startups" or something along the "acounting" line? D*mn straight he would. But is that what you see in his sig file? Nope. Do what you KNOW, people.... do what you KNOW!! I make my living 100% online. Many people do. Many, many people. One thing they have in common... they do what they KNOW and have training and experience in. If you don't know the trade, you won't make the grade. It's that simple. : ) Linda P.S. I ranted again. Sorry. lol

Hi Linda, As your post came in, I was actually rereading the other forum posts before I posted this one. and what you have just said confirms what I was about to suggest. From what I have seen on the Internet, the businesses and schemes that appear to work, are primarily product based - gardening tips etc are books and magazines. You yourself make Web pages, the MLM's of health products, car engine products etc etc are all product based.. I use the internet to sell my angels. In other words, we might use the internet for marketing, but we have something to sell. Your product, yes, can be carried out 100% online, because it is an Internet product. And there is always money to be invested if only indirectly. I agree with Norman that time and effort also has a cost (if you do it as alternative to a wage paying job). If you are spending no money on your internet work, you still have to eat in the meantime. What you are suggesting to Arthur is that he produces something to sell - an accounting product. I dont see how the rest of the internet schemes can work in the long term - they are just selling air. Saludos Jennifer

Hi Cheri, just a quick question - how does Art manage to use the web if his electricity is turned off? If he has found some magic way of doing this then this is where he could make a fortune! I am not too sure of the e-books route as an answer, but definitely a book on basic business accounting is a good idea. Now there are companies that do not require upfront fees to produce a 'real' book, and are great ways to set up a trial effort. I am currently trying one out as I have a lot of ideas (and written materials). Most Print On Demand companies require a set-up fee, and they do most of the work. Others not, and so there is almost no risk at all - but once again a bit of effort - notably in getting the words down, and learning the relatively simple instructions on the websites. I am at the moment working through a project with a company called http://www.lulu.com so I can't give an actual recommendation as to the final ptroduct just yet, but the costs are zero thus far. The site is very good - and Art should check it out. I have heard about two other companies - http://www.cafepress.com and http://www.parapublishing. com (that might be paru - can't read my own writing) - but I haven't checked them. I am not affiliated with any of these compnaies so 'caveat emptor' as they say - but it is at leasta start point? Finally - Dr Livingstone had moved on when I cleared the jungle yesterday! Cheers, Norm

Hello All, Good catch Norman. "just a quick question - how does Art manage to use the web if his electricity is turned off? If he has found some magic way of doing this then this is where he could make a fortune!" There are means, like the library and cyber cafes but times are limited and not all know how or where. I have seen this from several members within the past year and a half here at AdlandPro. The sounds of desparation and gonna loose it all and then there they are; with some miracle that kept them online. And they will gripe and say they can't afford a mere $4.00 - $5.00 a month for their business but you'll see them talk about the family outing on the weekend, bought something precious for their pet, new game for the kids ... I even remember a member, new at the time, asked me to critique their site. I did. I mentioned to buy a domain name and get a host. Their reply was as if I had broken a sacred vow and all I wanted was their money. Some have wanted proof by me giving them first the product/service. When you mention there will be labor costs you're back to "breaking the sacred vow" reaction. Some people are good manipulators and as much as we WANT to trust people we all need to set our limits as to how far we are willing to help. I'm sorry to say. I'm not saying this trying to sound greedy but as defense to those that do things out of greed. Amazing discussions here and thanks for sharing. __________ Kenneth R Sword Jr Co-CEO - Bizzy Blogz http://www.bizzyblogz.com Sponsor of the ABA Basketball 'Streetball' group "Nothing But Net Entertainment" http://www.bizzyblogz.com/NBNE/ New! Bizzy Blogz Community - like MySpace http://www.bizzyblogz.biz An Advertising Traffic Machine http://www.megatraffic.us/ http://www.frappr.com/bizzyblogzcommunity