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Myrna Ferguson

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RE: 'Mona Lisa' Copy Done Hand in Hand With Da Vinci
2/8/2012 5:11:31 PM
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Dear friends,

I am very sorry about my answer coming this late. I am particularly sorry in your case, Roger, since you contributed with your kind commentary four days ago. I wanted to do some research before posting any further info or comment on my part and then the days came and went without my noticing it for the most part. It has been happening most frequently of late to me; let me say, these are accelerated times.

But now to the point: Leonardo Da Vinci has always been a sort of springboard to fame to many experts especially concerning his Gioconda or "Mona Lisa," whose painting process and resulting intrinsic beauty has been fraught with mystery all along history - and this has very probably to do with Myrna's observation. I guess there has never been another work of art by any great artist which aroused so much interest or evoked so much wonder and, why not, so many investigations and commentaries.

This said, and to be frank, I find this one discovery that has motivated our own comments and interest is not, by very far, as good as the original. I may be wrong of course, but I think it is the legend surrounding the famous painting plus the frame of likely romance that it has always been immersed in - and so much more now - that has mainly contributed to the interest in the discovery. Add to it the possibility of a romance between Leonardo himself and the mysterious painter of the replica and we have the perfect ingredients to make it a success.

All this reminds me of another most important case of a replica in Leonardo's work, this one supposedly painted by one of his disciples:
his Madonna with the Yarnwinder (see below). In this case, it has always been thought that the original painting disappeared during Leonardo's life, in a fire... but given the great beauty and perfect execution of the extant one, I have always believed it to be painted by Leonardo himself, and that the one that disappeared very probably was painted by his disciple.

What do you think?

Hugs,

Miguel


Madonna with the Yarnwinder
by Leonardo da Vinci

Luis, there is one thing about your thoughts that do not go along with the back grounds. Look at the background on the 2nds that is thought to be painted by his disciple, they look more alike to me. Must more detail and color. Just my thoughts.

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Luis Miguel Goitizolo

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RE: 'Mona Lisa' Copy Done Hand in Hand With Da Vinci
2/8/2012 6:10:54 PM
Quote:
Quote:
Dear friends,

I am very sorry about my answer coming this late. I am particularly sorry in your case, Roger, since you contributed with your kind commentary four days ago. I wanted to do some research before posting any further info or comment on my part and then the days came and went without my noticing it for the most part. It has been happening most frequently of late to me; let me say, these are accelerated times.

But now to the point: Leonardo Da Vinci has always been a sort of springboard to fame to many experts especially concerning his Gioconda or "Mona Lisa," whose painting process and resulting intrinsic beauty has been fraught with mystery all along history - and this has very probably to do with Myrna's observation. I guess there has never been another work of art by any great artist which aroused so much interest or evoked so much wonder and, why not, so many investigations and commentaries.

This said, and to be frank, I find this one discovery that has motivated our own comments and interest is not, by very far, as good as the original. I may be wrong of course, but I think it is the legend surrounding the famous painting plus the frame of likely romance that it has always been immersed in - and so much more now - that has mainly contributed to the interest in the discovery. Add to it the possibility of a romance between Leonardo himself and the mysterious painter of the replica and we have the perfect ingredients to make it a success.

All this reminds me of another most important case of a replica in Leonardo's work, this one supposedly painted by one of his disciples:
his Madonna with the Yarnwinder (see below). In this case, it has always been thought that the original painting disappeared during Leonardo's life, in a fire... but given the great beauty and perfect execution of the extant one, I have always believed it to be painted by Leonardo himself, and that the one that disappeared very probably was painted by his disciple.

What do you think?

Hugs,

Miguel


Madonna with the Yarnwinder
by Leonardo da Vinci

Luis, there is one thing about your thoughts that do not go along with the back grounds. Look at the background on the 2nds that is thought to be painted by his disciple, they look more alike to me. Must more detail and color. Just my thoughts.



That's a good point Myrna, though may I remind you that it was just my thoughts too that I was airing in my post. Also, among the things that I have learned about Leonardo Da Vinci's obsession with his Gioconda is the fact that he never ceased to diffuminate both its face and the background by applying on them coat after coat of painting by means of a special "dry brush" process only known to him. This might explain why especially the Gioconda's backgroung looks kind of softer in trace and color than his other paintings.

On the other hand, if the
Madonna and Child with the Yarnwinder had in fact been painted by one of his disciples (however good he or she was), can you imagine how would the Leonardo's original would look itself? I have tried to figure it out but could, sincerely, not.

In addition, I have tried to learn whether there is
any definite conclusion over this issue at present by checking out the various catalogues of Leonardo's work and have found that the current trend is to no longer regard the Madonna and Child as any disciple's work but his own work.

Hugs,

Miguel


"Choose a job you love and you will not have to work a day in your life" (Confucius)

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Patricia Bartch

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RE: 'Mona Lisa' Copy Done Hand in Hand With Da Vinci
2/8/2012 6:27:52 PM
hi MIGUEL. i was enthralled reading this article about the MONA LISA. thank you for posting it. i love history ... especially history of europe... great britain, france, etc.

it is so interesting!! the MONA LISA is an wonderful painting. one of my favorites.
pat




Quote:

Spain: What the 'Mona Lisa' Contemporary Copy Reveals

By LISA ABEND / MADRID



The most mysterious painting in the history of European art just got a little more mysterious. For centuries, Madrid's Prado Museum has held what was believed to be a mere replica of Leonardo da Vinci's masterpiece, the Mona Lisa. But researchers at the museum recently discovered that their copy wasn't just any copy. Thanks to the use of infrared technology, they deduced that the work was not only painted in Leonardo's workshop, by one of his students, but that it was done at the same time as the master was completing the original.

Although the copy, which depicts La Gioconda with a narrower face, redder dress and significantly more pronounced eyebrows than the original, has been in the Prado's collection for centuries, no one thought much of it, and it was generally attributed to an unknown Flemish artist. But when the Prado's conservators began to study it in preparation for an upcoming show in Paris, they realized there might be more to the work than previously recognized. Using infrared technology, they detected a lush Tuscan landscape -- the same as in Leonardo's original -- hiding beneath the coat of black varnish that had been added probably in the 18th century and obscured the original background.
(See whether a male model inspired Leonardo da Vinci.)

That wasn't all they found. Infrared reflectography can reveal the sketches -- called underdrawings -- and changes that a painter makes in the course of composing a work. By comparing reflectography images taken of the Mona Lisa in 2004 with the copy (they matched), Prado conservators determined that the replica was painted while Leonardo was himself still at work on the original. "There is textual evidence from contemporary observers that Leonardo had assistants in his workshop making copies," says Miguel Falomir, the Prado's curator of Italian Renaissance art. "This is the first time we've found technical evidence of it as well."

'Mona Lisa' Copy Done Hand in Hand With Da Vinci


The painting is still being cleaned and restored, but the findings were presented two weeks ago at a technical conference for specialists held in conjunction with the blockbuster Leonardo exposition currently on show at the National Gallery in London. The reaction from experts in the field has been unanimously positive. "So far, I haven't heard one discordant voice," says Falomir. (See photos of theMona Lisa imitations.)

Which isn't to say that the discovery hasn't raised questions, including who painted it and when. "It had to have been a pupil, and someone very close to Leonardo at the time," says Matthew Landrus, art historian at Oxford University and the Rhode Island School of Design. "And no one was closer than Andrea Salai and Francesco Melzi." Still, he points out, that there is no definite evidence of their work. Salai, who some historians believe became Leonardo's lover, entered the workshop in 1490; Melzi, who the Prado believes to be the likelier author, joined around 1506.

But the bigger question is why Leonardo would have had his students replicating his work in the first place. Certainly the practice of making copies was not unique to him; many Renaissance artists had their students attempt to recreate their work. The reason may have been pedagogical, but more likely, says Falomir, it was financial. "When people think about these great geniuses creating, they forget that even these artists had to eat. Selling copies was a way of earning money." (Read "How a 'New' da Vinci Was Discovered.")

Landrus suggests it may have been more than that. After all, the Mona Lisa was still in Leonardo's possession when he died. It was never turned over to Francesco del Giocondo, the man who, according to 16th century biographer Giorgio Vasari, had commissioned the portrait of his wife, Lisa Gherardini, in celebration of the birth of their second son. "It's possible that Leonardo realized, 'Hey, I've got a pretty good painting here,' and had the copy made so he could keep something for himself," says Landrus. "Only later did he recognize that he didn't have to give the original away."

But Alison Wright, a specialist in Italian art at University College London who attended the meeting where the Prado discovery was presented, sees the copying as contemporary recognition of Leonardo's importance. "It's just conceivable that there was a copy made to sell, but it's an odd painting, and a commissioned portrait, so it's hard to imagine what the market would be," she says. "It's more likely that it was a matter of Leonardo's students recording his every movement, even while they were still falling from his brush." (See how experts authenticate art.)

The discovery is already causing art historians to re-examine their understanding of how Leonardo's studio functioned, and to revise the picture they have of how the most famous painting in Western art captured a singular moment between sitter and artist. "Once again," says Wright, "we see that technical analysis can shed light on a case we thought was shut."

But if the Prado copy raises new mysteries, it also clarifies some things. The newly restored copy, with its gleaming landscape in the background and sharp lines defining the spindle of the chair and the ruffle of the bodice, fills in details obscured by the yellowing varnish on the real Mona Lisa. "The original hasn't been restored in a long time," says Prado curator Falomir. "The copy invites you to see it with new eyes."

Read "Cracking a Real-Life Da Vinci Code."

Read about a long-lost da Vinci painting about to be unveiled.

View this article on Time.com


Hugs,
Luis Miguel Goitizolo

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Roger Macdivitt .

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RE: 'Mona Lisa' Copy Done Hand in Hand With Da Vinci
2/8/2012 8:16:50 PM

So often there is this intrigue surrounding Da Vinci's work which adds to the mystery.

Difficult to make any definite statement but good ideas expressed here.

The mystery just gets bigger.

Roger

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Luis Miguel Goitizolo

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RE: 'Mona Lisa' Copy Done Hand in Hand With Da Vinci
2/12/2012 10:00:12 PM
Quote:
hi MIGUEL. i was enthralled reading this article about the MONA LISA. thank you for posting it. i love history ... especially history of europe... great britain, france, etc.

it is so interesting!! the MONA LISA is an wonderful painting. one of my favorites.
pat


Thank you, Pat; I am so glad you like these articles and particularly the Mona Lisa, also one of my best favorites.

Sincerely,

Miguel

"Choose a job you love and you will not have to work a day in your life" (Confucius)

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